Let's talk about BT

[Brown]

Why do you use bit torrent, and why to the degree that you use it?

I first started using P2P when I was in elementary school, so that I could fill up the "Juice Box" (a pretty lame media player) that I had gotten for my birthday. To accomplish this, I used Limewire. Then a couple years later, in high school, a friend of mine told me that it was possible to download video games from past systems, and so he pointed me to a Rapidshare board whose main focus was video games. While at that board, I noticed that on occasion people would post a "torrent" file for large files (which would be promptly removed by the staff). I decided to investigate farther as to what this "torrent" was. That led me to ThePirateBay, where I happily grabbed computer programs and entire discographies (OK, only one discography). I had never been able to download entire albums like that in the blink of an eye before. Having found a new way to get music, I ditched Limewire. Eventually, I got a virus that devastated my computer, so I looked to alternate places to get files from, and stumbled upon this website. Eventually I was then invited to some great private trackers.

So as I so wordily said in the above paragraph, I use bittorrent for several different reasons: one, to get media for free (I don't care too much about the speed that I get it at, since there is always something else I can do in the meantime); two, to get media safely (no viruses); three, to discuss and talk about that media with other people who more often than not, share many of my interests; and four, to expose myself to music, games, movies, and experiences that I would not have otherwise been able to experience if it were not for filesharing. I've also got to know some pretty cool people in the process.

I've never really considered myself as a heavy, hardcore downloader. I hear about these people who download hundreds, if not a thousand, gigabytes a month, and just don't see how they manage it. I already feel like I have too much media to enjoy after only taking a year and a half to fill a small 500GB HD. Another reason that I use bittorrent as my main source of obtaining files is because it makes me feel good to know that I'm helping other people get files when I seed. I'm not really doing a whole lot to the files sitting on my computer (besides enjoying some of them), so why not share them and make someone's day? So I guess that I use bittorrent to a great degree...

What do you feel is the ideal tracker for you, and are you a member of a site that fills those requirements?

The ideal tracker for me is a place that I can get files without having all these requirements shoved down my throat, a place where the staff are friendly and personable, a place where the other members there share my interests and are willing to discuss them, a place where I "feel" safe, and a place where I can experience new things. An example of my second and fifth ideals can be something that just happened today. I got an announcement from a staff member, telling everyone to spam another staff member's inbox with messages about anything and everything. The staff member then goes on to say that if a certain number are received, good things will happen. I've never experienced something like this before, especially coming from staff. I decided to participate by giving him my math homework and asking him to do it. :P

Do you feel you are on enough trackers, and what do you think is too many trackers?

I am very comfortable with the number of trackers that I have right now. I must confess though that I belong to a number of trackers, but only because they all fill some sort of specific niche. I belong to two 0-day trackers, three music trackers, two general movie trackers, a rare/b-movie tracker, a modern video games tracker, a retro video games tracker, a mobile tracker, an applications tracker, a retro TV tracker, and a few general trackers (including Demonoid). It is my opinion that the more specialized a tracker is, the more they care about that particular thing, and the better experience I will have (discussions, files). I do think though that I could perhaps downsize, although I unfortunately am not in the habit of making use of "Request" sections. I also like to have a tracker to "fall back on", in case something were to happen to another tracker. Out of these trackers, I only "participate" (do things besides just download and seed) in five to six.

I honestly don't think that there is a "maximum" limit of trackers that one should belong to. Everyone has their own reasons for belonging to certain trackers, and I'm fine with that.

What do you see the politics of BT entailing, and does it affect your actions in this field?

I try not to get involved with politics and all the BT drama. However, I can say that I often see people attack one another, and bring up past mistakes as a weapon against them. I've also noticed that a lot of staff out there pay attention to how one behaves at other places, and act accordingly. A recent example of this is when a member who was invited to a particular tracker by another member of that tracker was soon after disabled by staff there, based on what the staff had observed of that invitee at other places. It sure enforced the sense that "the online BT community is global now". You have to be mindful of yourself at all times, or things may not happen as you wish them to.

Do you think there is an ethos necessary when interacting, and if so, what does it consist of? By this I mean what do you think the "morals" of BT are, if you think there should be.

I think that there are a few things that every good torrenter should do. One of these things should be to have a willingness to share. Whether this means uploading torrents, seeding them for a long time, or re-seeding torrents when requested, you're contributing to the entire community. This is "peer-to-peer", not "server-to-peer"; it takes a group effort to help other people obtain files. I also believe that one should respect any tracker wishes, and follow the rules. It's their site, and so they have the right to run it however they wish. If someone doesn't like it, then they can leave.

That's all that came to mind :happy:

[koqe]

I'm only serious about things that need to be taken seriously if that's any help.

PPS: About Albo and Cabalo: Constructive criticism is something that betters trackers. But the criticism that those two present is not constructive, neither is it argumented, but what bothers me the most is their approach (I'm repeating myself, I know :P). You hear a lot that at sites like TPS you have to suck dick and are not allowed to criticize sites. Not true. But if you do it the same way as those two do it here, expect to be banned. Fast.

I'm of an entirely different mindset on this because primarily a. they are only words b. they are only words directed at an inanimate object( a bt tracker ) which has no feelings and therefore is immune to harm c. there are more than one side to every argument and by seeing other ones you begin to reason instead of just follow.

@ Bad-Day since you have now more or less confirmed what was , at least to me, apparent from the outset that there is a lot more to you than first met the eye , I just wonder if you consider your presence here as aiding or mocking .And if mocking then aren't you as much of the problem as those like Albo who you disdain?

[GangsterBritishPirate]

Nice thread mate.



I started using BT just as a means to get media that's not available to me. Where I live it takes a long time for good things to come out. It's gotten better but when I started it wasn't uncommon for movies to be about a year behind the US pretty much the same for music while TV could take 2-3 years if it ever arrives at all. Once I learned about filesharing I started using Napster though that was at the end of its run and I quickly moved on to Kazza (gnutella) and when that turned to shit I started using BT.

I pretty much still use BT for those reasons though I like the community and interaction it entails that other forms of file sharing haven't offered me.

What do you feel is the ideal tracker for you, and are you a member of a site that fills those requirements?

The ideal tracker for me is one that has the content I want to download within a reasonable time frame at reasonable speeds without sacrificing what I see as the spirit of sharing. By that I mean I'm not interested in money making p2l p2i sites that spend thousands a month on their scene access and servers just to be a second or two faster than their competitors. Even worse are the few sites that are actually geared towards making money. That for me is completely evil and turns BT from sharing into stealing.

And yes my needs are filled quite nicely, but then again I've been around a while so I would expect them to be.

Do you feel you are on enough trackers, and what do you think is too many trackers?

IMO I'm on too many trackers. I've culled them down over the years and I have a few that I use regularly. The rest that I haven't abandoned I keep because of personal relationships.

Generally I think 5-6 trackers is about right. You'll want two 0-day in case one goes down then a few that are specialised to meet your particular needs. In my case I have a few music trackers. One that has everything and others that specialise in the type of music I like to listen to. On top of that you'll want a good user upload site for interesting different content and of course demonoid for all the rare stuff you can't find.

There is a tendency for people to become obsessed with getting on as many trackers as they can. Members always think the next tracker could have that upload the others don't and when you first get on the BT scene you'll find that you quickly have 20-30.

Now most people will look at this and say to themselves well they actually all have the same stuff and I don't really need all these sites to fulfill my needs and start letting them go inactive. Others however get caught up in level chasing and treat them like Pokemon cards for collecting and trading.

I actually see it as a kind of sickness and it's done a lot of harm to the BT world. People never end up giving back to the communities they're members of and just do the bare minimum. It's actually quite sad because there are some good friendships to be had and it can be quite satisfying to focus your efforts and see a positive result.

There's also the tendency to allow this hobby to interfere with RL. If you can't find that balance then get out now. Nothing on torrents is worth sacrificing a second of real life for.

What do you see the politics of BT entailing, and does it affect your actions in this field?

Now this is a massive question. I'm going to try not to go into a long rant on the politics of BT, but it's a doozy.

The worst part of BT is the ugly side of the politics and the egos. Too many times I've seen people's character assassinated and the massive shit storms that ensue can I admit be fun to watch but are sickening to be a part of. I guess it comes down to a large group of people interacting. Once that happens you're bound to have some ugly politics because lets face it the world is full of people with low scruples or who are just downright vindictive.

Part of the problem as I see it is the age and maturity level of members of the community. As the age of BT users has gotten younger and it's become the dominant form of file sharing the politics have become much harsher and there's a tendency to gang up on people much like in high school. Personally I try to stay out of it, but that's not always possible for whatever reason.

Do you think there is an ethos necessary when interacting, and if so, what does it consist of? By this I mean what do you think the "morals" of BT are, if you think there should be.

Yes I think there is personal ethos and morals to be adhered too as part of this community. It's important that people (particularly site staff) treat everyone with respect and as a fellow human. It's too easy to start writing people off because you're in a position of power or even just because you're sitting behind a computer.

For me it's all about treating people as I want to be treated, but I guess that attitude is important for all aspects of life not just this online hobby. When it comes to getting along in the BT world remember sharing is caring

Thanks again for the good topic mate it's been quite some time since I've been inspired to actually write a post on this board that's more than one line or isn't because someone made me angry.

[Kawaii]

You create an opinion based on experience as Duckater says and the same holds true about people.
If I edited ever stupid thing that came out of people's virtual mouths how could anyone tell who was a fool and who wasn't?

[justlilolme]

I'm of an entirely different mindset on this because primarily a. they are only words b. they are only words directed at an inanimate object( a bt tracker ) which has no feelings and therefore is immune to harm c. there are more than one side to every argument and by seeing other ones you begin to reason instead of just follow.

A tracker has no feelings, but people who work hard to keep the tracker going and constantly improving do.

I said that it's good you see both sides of an argument. Still asking to remain civilised while expressing yourself is not too much, don't you think?

I've seen you say your mind about trackers and I know you do it in a totally different way than Albo for instance (even when you're basically saying the site sucks).

[neverrusty]

whats your idea of a good member on a torrent site then?coz in my thinking,you can't put a bar on it and say that this is the exemplar for everyone else to look upon.
On the site you patently staff on for example,community comes first or so i've heard and from that I can draw forum activity and IRC being key for anyone to be considered an ideal member.My question then begs,how do you think you are fairing as of this scenario?(90% participation being an A, anything below an F).

To draw a queer parallel,TL(as being a for files tracker)will prune this 10% who aren't using the tracker as its meant to be.It would be informative to know whether you live upto the brand and do actually indeed do something about your bad users as well.

Well the tute I was talking about was more about explaining how ratios work and why it's important to give back what you take, basic stuff like that.

To answer your question I agree with you. I think there is no 'one' ideal type of member. Everybody does what they can. Some just download and help that way. Others seed till it bleeds and keep torrents alive. Some people might bring their fast pipes while others participate in the forums and IRC while some just live in the IRC and you never see them on the site hardly at all.

Every 'good' member just does what comes natural to them really and take part in the way they feel like. Just because someone doesn't want to take part in the forums doesn't make them a bad member lol it is a tracker after all. Conversely you could be the most well known member in the forums and IRC and if you piss all over the tracker by not sharing back what you take then you're still going to have a problem.

As for fsc well I guess we have a reputation for being 'community' based because we're small only about 1800 members and we like to encourage a community spirit in our forums and we actually believe in the moto sharing is caring. For us it's about sharing files and talking to people who share common interests or even just bring something interesting to the table. We do it for the love of it not the money or the ego or the fucking 1337 of it.

Above all though the site was founded on a policy of respect, so yes we've fostered a community but that doesn't mean you're a bad member if you don't want to participate in the forums and IRC we don't think about it like that at all. TBH I'd say only 20-30 percent of our members are active in the forums and even less on the IRC but our goal isn't to make sure every member is active in the community side. All we want is to provide a small, secure and private place for friends and friend of friends to share and if they wish they can have a chat about whatever they like.

As to your other point do we punish bad users, yes we do all the time. Though we actually try to work with people and give them a chance to step up before slamming the ban hammer down and no member is ever going to be punished for not taking part in the community side lol. We did prune a bunch of inactive members a while ago but that was people who hadn't logged on and they could all have their accounts back if they wanted.

[Mrs Delusional]

Really good thread this, some interesting and well thought out responses



After using a bit of the old napster at uni I had some time away from the net, when I got back online at home a few years ago I managed to pretty much bypass fasttrack and gneutella and arrived straight at BT (apart from Soulseek). I've always been into music, films and games but had got exceeding frustrated that all my old (bought) vhs & casette tapes were becoming obselete, so I set about replacing them initially, and then expanding my collections. There's been points over the years that downloading has become almost an obsession, trying to get everything I could ever possibly want to watch/listen to/play etc, but these days I'm much more selective and prefer to pick up rare or interesting things and help keep them alive for others who'll enjoy them as I do.

What do you feel is the ideal tracker for you, and are you a member of a site that fills those requirements?

I was very lucky in many ways that my first introduction to private trackers was by a real life friend, to a site that I much later discovered was much coveted by many (for all the wrong reasons). Over time, through open signups or randomly offered invites I gained access to a lot of other great sites, but for ages I considered that first site to be the ideal tracker for me. It felt personal, like I was sharing with a small group of real people round the globe rather than just faceless masses, and I met some great people there through random convo's started over a torrent comment or an upload etc.

I'm not sure I still feel the same though. Things change, it started to feel like a lot of new people on that site were there for the wrong reasons, or maybe I've just gained more perspective or become more cynical. I still use that site, and like it, but I would no longer call it ideal. Nor would I call any other site that either, some are more or less ideal for a particular niche content, but all have their up and downsides. Content is the main thing for me, "community" is a much over-used word where torrent sites are concerned, I'm not a big one for irc and most of their forums are pretty naff so I'm rarely that bothered with them (I run a football related forum anyway which takes up most of my chatting time on the net), however its always nice to find sites where members go out of their way to help others out, and that happens on most of my favourites.

Do you feel you are on enough trackers, and what do you think is too many trackers?

Definitely enough, I think I've signed up for like 1 or 2 new sites in the last year or so, certainly no more than that. I think "too many" depends on what sort of thing you tend to share, I certainly don't think anyone needs more than a small handful of 0-day sites and always laugh when I see people trying to get into some l33t site when they obviously have access to many others with exactly the same content. I've always liked to spread my downloading / seeding of certain things around a bit so I do maintain active accounts on probably around a dozen sites, of which say a couple are music related, a couple gaming, several for old and new films, a couple of larger 0-days and then one or two smaller trackers. I've had several prunes of my bookmarks in the not so distant past, and probably will have another again soon.

What do you see the politics of BT entailing, and does it affect your actions in this field?

I just try to keep out of all that as much as possible. A lot has changed in BT over the years, I could go on forever about silly levels lists, the proliferation of seedboxes & pointless account "buffering", trading and anti-trading, inter-site disputes, speed whores, money making, back stabbing and "stealing", but I won't as this post is well long enough already, and none of it really effects me massively. I definitely preferred things the way they used to be, or perhaps that was just the way I perceived them, but what can you do? Ultimately the main purpose of BT for me has always been and will always be to share files, everything else is coincidental.

Do you think there is an ethos necessary when interacting, and if so, what does it consist of? By this I mean what do you think the "morals" of BT are, if you think there should be.

Lol, honour among thieves and all that? I think everyone has their own standards, personally I'm usually quite respectful of people in real life and see no need to change that on the interwebs. I respect every site I'm on's rules, and understand that I'm a guest there, they call the shots and if I don't like it I can simply leave and go elsewhere. I believe in seeding because I want to, not because I'm told to. I wish more people felt the same but i'm not going to lose sleep when they don't, there's much more important things in the world. :happy:

[HannahBee]

1337 doesn

[kaciedeb]

My brother used Audiogalaxy, Napster, Edonkey, TribalWeb (now GigaTribe) at home ...i moved to BT because i was tired to have fake files with eMule.

What do you feel is the ideal tracker for you, and are you a member of a site that fills those requirements?

I don't think that the ideal tracker can exist ... i prefer a "specialized tracker", as WhatCD, BCG, Goem...( i know that Stoi love these words ), where i can easily find what i'm looking for.

Do you feel you are on enough trackers, and what do you think is too many trackers?

I always find stuRAB which i need, then yes, i can tell that i'm on enough trackers.I'm on no 1337 tracker, and i don't feel the need, because i can't see what they can bring to me and what i can bring to them.Some of you are going to tell me "Community" (or something like that)...i'm on specialized forums for that, and i'm already member of a great community (i'm sorry to tell you that it's not here).
What also bothers me is that most trackers forums are filled with the same people who post the same topics, and even putting the best of intentions I find this boring.

What do you see the politics of BT entailing, and does it affect your actions in this field?

I try to find the way to not be a sheep...and not be a rebel at the same time.
As Funkin'said:

"Bt politics" interest me none. I just do my thing and try to stay within the rules of each tracker I belong to(whether I agree with them or not)

Do you think there is an ethos necessary when interacting, and if so, what does it consist of? By this I mean what do you think the "morals" of BT are, if you think there should be.

I think that kallieb is right.

Say thanks to those who share, offer help when you can, fill a request if you're able, don't bail on a seed if you're the last one, and check in on teh site regularly enough to at least demonstrate that you're not taking up space on the tracker for ego - but that you actually want to be there.

But nowadays people are more and more individualistic, the BT allows to avoid it a little, the BT=Sharing: but not only files, we exchange everything: the knowledge, the utopias, the visions, the discoveries, the informations etc....
I find hallucinating that people through the BT, the forums, or the web are capable of speaking to strangers, while most part of them are incapable to do it IRL. You can call it " the magic of the internet " if you want.
(I don't know how is your country, but here, when you say "Hello" to somebody, he has reflex to touch (or hide) its moneybag, or to lower eyes!)

PS: It's funny that all the threads at one time or another, end up talking about Albo or Cabalo

[14T]

You're probably right mate about too much to offer and no one to enjoy it. But yes people do enjoy the trackers they belong to. Every site has their diehards and you can see the enjoyment they get out of it easily. I'd also say that the vast majority of members that you never see and just download are also enjoying it well at least enjoying having access to free media.